110 LSA: On the contrary, it is pretty unpleasant to inform you that the efficient compression rate decreases at 110 LSA. A cam card with its myriad numbers, acronyms, and abbreviations is one red-pen stroke away from a failed math test. We promise not to use your email address for anything but exclusive updates from the Power Automedia Network. The Fora platform includes forum software by XenForo. "When the low-pressure wave in the exhaust reflects into the intake, the pressure delta actually helps pull air and fuel into the cylinder. Moreover, a user from the Chevelle forum said. This table will create a map in your head, and I bet it will make your understanding crystal clear. And better gas mileage. Contrariwise, 106 LSA car engines are the best choice for people seeking energy-efficient cars with moderate engine power. by flat4racer17 Mon May 12, 2003 1:40 pm, Post When you purchase through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission, which supports our community. Build your own custom newsletter with the content you love from EngineLabs, directly to your inbox, absolutely FREE! It had a robust powerband with tons of usable torque. Maybe even 114. Thanks again. But to choose the perfect cam, all of that information needs understanding. Call for details with your specific combination. Lobe Separation Angle "LSA "Jump to Latest Follow 1 - 17 of 17 Posts . hydraboost is the same as a vacuum brakebooster, only the booster is replaced by a unit that does the same but under hydraulic pressure. The higher the compression and the higher you try and rev it, the more it will like a wider lobe center. A tighter LSA is always going to have more overlap, which allows the exhaust and intake systemif they're tuned wellto work together.". I think that cam had 110 lobe sep. Im loking at a summit cam with close to the same lift and duration #s but 114 lobe sep. It a 355. thanks in advance. See all 14 photos 13 The three power curves indicate that the wide (120-degree). 112 vs 114 lobe centers You cannot tell the differance in the two . 03 The 4.000-inch crank and 6.125-inch rods were combined with a set of forged asymmetrical pistons from JE. so the power will come on a litter sooner with the 114, and fall off a little sooner? Making this the biggest obstacle to overcome when selecting a cam profile with one of our tech advisors, explaining the definition and importance of the Lobe Center. This was science at work, and with data in tow, it was time to crunch the numbers and find out what was going on. "Ninety-nine percent of cranking compression is dictated by static compression ratio and intake-valve closing point," said Comp Cams' Billy Godbold. A forum community dedicated to hot rod owners and enthusiasts. How To Properly Replace Ignition CoilsContinue. General topics - 76 LA built, CA car with m20. In my opinion, the rougher the idle the better! The 114 LSA is good for a blower or nitros motor. 106 LSA: There is an increasing chance of engine knock at the 106 lobe separation angle. The 112-degree cam (red lines) picked up much of the torque, but the big winner was the cam with the tightest lobe separation angle. The second cam would have a rougher idle, produce more torque and would rev quicker. Again this is dependent on your shift rpm and assuming you truly have 14-1 compression. Adding an aftermarket cam to an otherwise stock engine can boost output by 40-60 hp (or more) with no other changes (except possibly a valvespring upgrade). A forum community dedicated to vintage Ford Mustang owners and enthusiasts. Tuning this cam would be slightly more difficult due to the reduced idle vacuum, but it is hard to argue with all the extra power. Armed with more information on camshaft theory, what will you build? Realize what the engine is going in, however, as you may not be able to use the wildest cam out there. But for small-block Chevys (like the LS applications in this story), the LSA is ground into the cam. I think you are asking a lot of a cam . Thanks for the replies, particularly that link Marc, very informative. 108 vs 112 lobe seperation. As you can see in the graph, the 101 LSA cam actually had the highest cranking compression of the batch: 185 psi. It affects the amount of valve overlap; that is the brief period of time when both the intake and exhaust valves are open.. . A cam with a 112 lobe center will idle smoother than a cam with a 110 lobe center. Here are the basics: higher lift values open the valves to increase airflow and longer duration keeps the valves open longer. This is ground into the cam and can't be changed without changing cams. I normally run a 106 to a 108 because I like the "hit" a tighter LC cam has when it come up on the came. Depending on the engine combination, the opposite results can occur. Unfortunately, good street manners are often at odds with performance, as wilder cam timing usually decreases idle and (low-speed) driveability. This cam split the difference between the 101 and 113 down the middle, and in theory should have walked the line between the results of the last two tests in every waywhich it did. Engine builders Chuck Lawrence, left, and Doug Patton. (ICL + ECL) / 2 = LOBE SEPARATION ANGLE (LSA) LSA is a RESULT of the PROPER events. If it occurs too late, it will lean out the cylinder and greatly hinder the performance of the engine. It produces peak torque earliercoming on quicker and strongerbut also it falls off quicker too. Let's just talk lobe sep angle. I do believe that stock VW seperation is 108 and 112 is used alot in turbo and midrange cams for VW's while 106 is used for the top end cams. This may be of concern if you have vacuum assisted accessories, such as power brakes or steering. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. (You can find an instructional video of how to do just that on our Clay Smith Cams YouTube Channel;https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=57gfBu8uc6k&t=1s ). For Example: A 110-degree lobe separation means that the peak opening points of the Intake and Exhaust lobes is 110 degrees apart. Increased overlap improves upper RPM power. A cam with 110 lobe center will pull approximately 14-18"of vacuum is borderline for that type of application. If you compared these two cams side by side in identical engines, the first cam would actually have a slightly better idle and would produce slightly more peak power at upper RPM's. . JavaScript is disabled. Pretty much standard for an RV type cam. 110 LSA: On the contrary, 110LSA has a higher piston-to-valve clearance rate. The standard bore block was then stuffed with a 4340 forged steel 4.0-inch crank and 6.125-inch rods, along with a set of flat-top, forged JE pistons. 110 LSA: On the other hand, 110 LSA is comparatively a wider LSA; it can generate a massive amount of RPM for the engine. you cannot just take a random change in a lobe separation angle and say 1 is better than the other. A cam's lobe separation determines where and for how long peak torque occurs in an engine's rpm range. Given that nitrous works best in the mid- to upper-rpm range, nitrous-powered engines need a wider lobe separation, like 112 . 110 LSA: On the contrary, if you look at the powerband at 110 LSA, the powerband is comparatively broader. We borrowed Westech Performance's shop mule, a 370ci small-block Chevy and its SuperFlow 902 engine dyno and spent a day running each cam back-to-back to gauge its effect on peak horsepower, peak torque, cranking compression, idle vacuum, and the powerband as a wholeall the variables that define an engine's character on the street and track. Getting back to the sound of an engine, its no secret that a raucous, lumpy idle is often preferred by street cruisers, regardless of the ill manners and inefficiency of such an engine setup. Now here is where it gets tricky. Anybody here run a 108 LSA? Check out the Comp Cams catalog, even the biggest hydraulic rollers use 110. not exactly true, Ive seen custom grinds that are on 108 lca, smooth idle, high vacuum an even able to run efi, usually on an off the shelf cam it is true. Cylinder-head flow and LSA are directly related: as a rule of thumb, the better the head flows, the wider the LSA can be. To reiterate another point, I realize that wider LSAs tend to broaden the power band, but for a car I would like to bracket race a bit, as well as enjoy on the street, I was told that a narrower LSA will help the car accelerate at a faster rate. As a result, you can enjoy a pleasing engine outcome. If all the specs remained the same what will going from a 110 to a 112 lsa do to driving characteristics? What Are The Wastegate Stuck Open Symptoms? thanks. i have a 4 bolt 351C, stock bore, 10.5 cr with 351C Boss heads ,boss crank and rods. somthing to that aspect. Higher overlapping lets less oil fall through the oil inlet. ALL bolts are ARP. Pretty much standard for an RV type cam. Say you have a cam ground on a 115 and the other on a 110. All rights reserved. The final, 108-degree cam stepped power up even further, with peaks of 572 hp at 6,300 rpm and 544 lb-ft at 5,200 rpm. Well, I saw that Erson makes some nice hydraulic rollers with 108 LSAs, and I know that tighter LSAs have more midrange, so I thought they might be worth a try. Looking at 108vs. As usual, Marc (aka Master) is correct. This causes the engine's street manners and tuning to become fickle. Nothing makes mouths drop like a car that sounds and looks like it can't keep it self still! in some cases,, the average torque can equal out. If you look at any given cam catalog, you will find that the majority of street-oriented cams fall in this range. Because during the lower units oil change, you can go through the issue that the lower plug, Read More Yamaha Lower Unit Drain Plug Size [Explained Everything]Continue, Among the crucial parts of a vehicle ignition system is the ignition coil, also called a spark coil. by xstfudonniex Fri Dec 12, 2008 5:24 pm, Post I would have to say that your cam choice sounds like a winner to me. So the wider LSA introduces a broader and therefore longer torque band.. Ed JTO learn to park Joined May 31, 2009 180 Posts The lobe separation angle or LSA is the angle in camshaft degrees between the maximum lift points, or centerlines, of the intake and exhaust lobes. The introduction of Lunati'snew Bootleggerhydraulic series - with its wicked 108-degree lobe-separation angle, fast opening profile and plenty of area under the lift curve - will serve only to fuel the flames on this heated bench-racing topic. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. whats the difference in how the car will run. The Fora platform includes forum software by XenForo. from the intake to the exhaust and vise-versa.Thats why a performance cam will usually have a rougher idle than a stock one. While lift and duration are most often discussed when talk turns to cam timing, there is a third variable that has a decided effect on both power and personality. Required fields are marked *. = Moderately Wide 110-108 Deg. Is it a hydraulic roller as well? Similarly, 110 LSA is also found to be a more fabulous performer in several mechanical aspects. We use 86b webcams with 1.25 rockers frequently in stroker motors.It's a nice way of getting close to .500" for hot street motors with average heads. . " - Voltaire. With a 108 degree lobe center, a cam will have a rougher idle and produce less vacuum due to more overlap. Now that we have a basic understanding of lobe separation angle, we can put together a test to illustrate just what happens when you make changes to it. 2.1.2.4.2 Side-lobe suppression shall be provided in accordance with the provisions of 3.1.2.1.5.2.1 on all Mode S-only all-call interrogations. This is why the LS series, and many other modern engines, can make great power on top and bottom with wide LSA camshafts and why a plethora of factory cylinder heads are flowing near (or above) 300 cfm. It's the scavenging effect of the high velocity exhaust gases rushing out that pulls the fresh fuel/air charge into the chamber. The lobe separation angle is a comprise of what the engine needs depending on the compression, combustion chamber, rpm, engine size, head volume, and many, many other variables. The 110 is probably a better choice for a performance street engine. 106 LSA: On the contrary, if we look at the 106 LSA, we will find it more advantageous and energy efficient than the 110 LSA engine. But nothing comes without a cost, and idle vacuum suffers as LSA shrinks. Exhaust reversion is another undesirable side effect that can be caused by overlap. We do not stock profiles with 109 or 114 lobe centers. A wide lobe seperation is not always better than a narrow one, or vise versa. A good amount of idle vacuum or increased idle vacuum found at 110 LSA advances the engines efficiency. Because the lobes are closer together on the 101 LSA cam, the intake closing point is advanced (closes earlier) and the piston has more time to build compressionexactly what the gauge showed. Defining Lobe Center and It's Importance to Engine Performance: A Blog. 07 Though the CNC-ported heads offered plenty of flow, it was necessary to upgrade the supplied valvesprings. Part Number: HRS-CL120325-08. ( 2 ) Estimated Ship Date: Feb 23, 2023 (if ordered today) Drop Ship. TH400 Vs Powerglide: Which One is Ideal for You? Lobe separation angle does. But, the internal processings are much more complicated. On a torque graph it tends to resemble a triangular shape.. 110 LSA: Oppositely, the cylinder pressure is comparatively lower at 110 LSA than at 106 LSA. How do the lobe separations change when you factor in turbocharging? GRIND #: CRB3 3194 /3196 HR111. When you purchase through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission, which supports our community. 110* LSA - lobe separation angle (lobe displacement angle) The +2* means your intake lobe centerline is advanced to obtain a 108* ICL - intake centerline and a 112* ECL - exhaust centerline. Due to the tightness and frequent overlapping of the intake and exhaust valves, the engine cant generate the high RPM as it is supposed to. Boom, you get the lobe separation angle of that engine. A narrower lobe separation angle can provide less power but can also lead to less wear. Howards Cams Retro-Fit Hydraulic Roller Camshaft and Lifter Kits CL120325-08. The balance of midrange torque and top-end horsepower lends this LSA range to the majority of street/strip engines. Its also critical that valve overlap is kept to a minimum as the induction system can create a suction that pulls water into the motor, adds Bolander. Generally, naturally aspirated engines run narrower lobe separation angles of around 106 to 108 whereas supercharged, turbo or nitrous engines operate with 112 to 114 and higher. 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My lift will be about .580" intake and exhaust, with about 230/236 duration with a 1.7 rocker ratio, utilizing a Jesel shaft rocker system. But an interestingly shocking fact is that this event escalates the air-fuel mixtures reaction rates, causing temperatures to rise and causing the problem of overheating the engine. Once more the engine came apart to install the third test cam, a 107 LSA. So, this LSA is suitable for your engine and its components. In reality, a cam with 220 at 0.050" and a lobe center angle of 112 will have the exact same mechanical overlap as a cam with 217 at 0.050" and a lobe center angle of 109. A cam 112LSA with 4 degrees advance puts the intake centerline at 108 degrees. It will sound lovely I'm sure. If identical and for a given displacement the 110 will give more power. Split duration/lift only helps when your intake/exhaust ratio is low on the exhaust side. These favorable mechanical features depict the powerful acceleration capacity of the engine with higher oil and energy consumption rate, overheating problems, and other mechanical problems. To demonstrate changes to lobe separation in action, we ordered three camshafts from Comp Cams, all ground with identical lift (0.541 intake and 0.537 exhaust) and duration (230 intake and 236 exhaust) but with three different LSAs: a 101, a 107, and a 113.
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